[Tam Toucan]

I think the whole issue with 'accessability' will always divide people. Whilst I can see Ian's view, I also don't 100% agree with it - to me making something more accessible in these ways can change your original vision for the game - and the point of making a game is to create your (or, in terms of remakes, someone elses) vision. Accessible or not, not everyone's going to like what you've done. Which is a good thing.
That said, however, I decided to put those 'customisable' options in as a way of at least allowing the game to be tailored slightly. I think those that want to play the game for what it originally was can by just ignoring these options.

I a similar view and Bob and I had a discussion about it in the old forum. I was struggling with wanting to add stuff, but not "spoil" the game e.g. make it too easy for some people and not "change the vision" (should Da Vinci make Mona Lisa look more happy?). E.g. if you make it too easy then people see the entire game and then don't play it agin.

But the conclusion I came to was it it's never a bad thing to give people options to play the game the way they want to play it. It's the cost/reward to yourself that should be the limiting factor. People don't need to press the "See entire walkthrough" button. Those that do weren't going to play the game much anyway. A lot of the time all the designer is doing is making me play the game more, not out of fun, but because of compulsion/stubbornness/etc. E.g. I want to see all the levels, but I'm not actually enjoying the grindfest.

So I agree with what your saying, but I don't see options as "changing the vision", the original is still there and people will just hit "Play" the first few times, then realize "Bah this is too hard/easy/slow/green" and see if they can change it. Options just make it more enjoyable for the players. That can never be a bad thing.

Not putting them is with the view of "Not changing the vision" is actually "I want to force you to play my game like this because I don't want anyone to play it any other way", which is fine so long as it's realised (and you seem to get this with the "not everyone's going to like what you've done. Which is a good thing." comment). The flame wars start when folk don't realize it and get all "cock wavy".

[Ian]

Exactly what I said. You can add the options after the game has been completed with no compromise to your original idea(s). Which FatSeagal has done

[FatSeagal]

I don't think i'll be offering accessability options with my next game though. Then again, it is a point-n-click text adventure, so it isn't really possible. Starting the game with all puzzles solved really would make the game pointless! :o)

Here's an updated version. Should've got rid of the 'sticky' problem, and corrected the end game screen errors.

[Tam Toucan]

I don't think i'll be offering accessability options with my next game though. Then again, it is a point-n-click text adventure, so it isn't really possible. Starting the game with all puzzles solved really would make the game pointless! :o)

With family life I don't really have time to play games and if something like Ben There Dan That had a "Play walkthrough" I'd love that...as it is I just feel sad that I'll never get to see it all. So not having the option has "spoiled" it for me. Of course if you put in a "Solve this puzzle" button someone might press it and then feel sad that they didn't do it themselves, but it's their choice (just and not finding the time to play the game is my choice).

[Lobo]

...as the two are twins

Yes but Learic has blue chunk of hair where Leanoric has green .
Here's the screen anyway, some cut in two frames as you like to animate things so maybe that works. If you have better idea to go about it-do it. Also, spellbook gfx just in case needed.
Cheerio.

[blarp]

Was looking for a remake of Feud online and found this First off would like to say it's fantastic that someone's spending time redoing it! Feud is one of the best designed and sinister games I've ever played.

But I'm not sure you understand the gameplay. Have you read the Pickford Bros' article on making Feud? (http://www.zee-3.com/pickfordbros/games/oldgame.php?game=feud&parent=../friends/favourites)

In terms of what you can see, the huge screen area in your remake gives the player too much information.  The tension in the original was a product of moving from one (legend of zelda) size screen to another, having to actually *learn* the map and the positions of the herbs; each place had a very definite character and location, and you couldn't see a lot at once(http://www.zee-3.com/pickfordbros/games/sshots/feud04.jpg).

The map at that scale seemed challenging, and walking around it was a lonely experience interrupted only when you found remembered where to find a particular herb (reward! there was also a lot of strategy involved in which herbs you went for first, based on your recollection) or came upon Leonoric, who would suddenly and frighteningly appear on top of you and in striking range. You knew his general direction from the compass (which you've left out of your version) or would catch a glimpse of him in or from the maze, or rushing past you to another area. You never knew whether he'd collected herbs before he appeared to cast a spell - though from the direction of the compass you could guess where he *might* be. And when you ran away you never had more than a general idea of your direction, until you'd played it a lot.

The compass also reminded you he was out there, somewhere. You repeatedly flicked between your small view of the screen and the N,S,E, and W arrows, trying to think in what area he might be, though - cleverly - you could always see his (sinister looking) image like a gravestone in the bottom of the screen next to your (possibly depleted) statue, doubling as his health.

You also couldn't see every spell in the spellbook at once (you had to do it again while rushing around trying to find the right combination of herbs - purely from memory - before Leonoric killed you with lightning).

Your graphics could use a bit of tweaking for atmosphere too. The original graphics chose a discrete number of colours playing off black. The green was mostly displayed against black, and the wizards were white. It think this is important: the resulting atmosphere was deceptively empty, something like the nazgul/forest hide and seek from the Fellowship of the Ring film (to use a popular example!):

What you've done (IMHO!) is make it a bit Disney map 2d player vs player, which is why people are asking you to go the full length (and make it even simpler). You've obviously put a ton of work into reproducing the map and making Leonoric move around. There's loads done but with some small (but big!) tweaks I think you can get much closer to the tension and scares of the original experience - or even improve on them.

Would be really interested in getting involved (or contributing some graphics, say !!) if you're still working on this.

[FatSeagal]

Thanks for your feedback, but I have to say that I do understand the gameplay of the original. The point of this mini-make (and all others that I do/have done) is to produce a different kind of game but keeping the spirit and idea of the original - something which I feel this manages to do. I've got code lying around somewhere from a straight version of this game and I don't think it would be too difficult or take too long to knock up a version almost identical to the original if that's what people want, but that wasn't the intention here.

I'm working on two other projects at the moment, but maybe I'll do a non-mini version of Feud afterwards...

[Spraydough]

Would be really interested in getting involved (or contributing some graphics, say !!) if you're still working on this.

Offering graphics around here is a very dangerous thing to do.

I for one wouldn't want to see you injured in the oncoming rush.....

[blarp]

>Thanks for your feedback, but I have to say that I do understand the gameplay of the original. The point of this mini->make (and all others that I do/have done) is to produce a different kind of game but keeping the spirit and idea of the >original - something which I feel this manages to do.

Don't mean to be an argumentative git but I disagree Understand the idea, and the community and technical kick out of doing it, but with respect I don't see how it works for this game. Feud is about exploring full-sized screens. It's cute to give a cloud's eye view of the map like you're an angel or God (!) but it wipes out all the tension. If the spirit of the original was there, people who'd never played it would really get it. And unless I've gone blind, you've already had people in the thread talking about how the game mechanics were 'broken.'

Well, the original sold 180,000 copies; the game mechanics were fine there.

Not trying to pick a fight. It's just that it's done, right! You've got the community support and it's part of the series.

I don't mean do a version slavishly identical to the original: there are loads of stuff that could be done to improve graphics and sound without ditching essential gameplay mechanics, and you could add complications, not take them away. A really scary Feud in 32-bit colour with alpha fog effects, great sound, folk metal soundtrack - voice acting, even

>I'm working on two other projects at the moment, but maybe I'll do a non-mini version of Feud afterwards...
>Offering graphics around here is a very dangerous thing to do.
>I for one wouldn't want to see you injured in the oncoming rush.....

Well, I was kindof offering to do graphics on Feud, specifically Though understand if the apparent nebulousness of blabbing on about the original makes me look a bit näieve.

[Sokurah]

Though understand if the apparent nebulousness of blabbing on about the original makes me look a bit näieve.

You nerd!

...hehe, welcome to RR - a place populated by nerds.

Seriously, I can see how many of the well thought out aspects a game like Feud loses when it's done like a 'mini' version, but describing it like "It's cute to give a cloud's eye view of the map like you're an angel or God" is thinking too much about it, as it's more meant as a funny idea than a "solid remake". It's simply not meant as a definitive remake - more as a "companion piece" to a more accurate (future)remake. I'm not sure FatSeagal agrees but that's the way I see it.

Personally I think it could be fun to make a mini version of, oh, Underwurlde, or something. I don't think it would help the game in any way - just as I don't think its helped any of the other mini-remakes I've seen - like Sabre Wulf, but it's just another way of having some fun and doing something slightly different than what people normally see.

There's still not a perfect version of Feud so "we" could still use a really good remake of it, so I'm sure someone will jump at the chance if there's a dedicated artist and ideaman to help out.

[FatSeagal]

It's simply not meant as a definitive remake - more as a "companion piece" to a more accurate (future)remake. I'm not sure FatSeagal agrees but that's the way I see it.

He does.
The whole point of this game was to be a different take on a classic game. Mission accomplished I believe.

Now go play Mini Saboteur (www.fatseagal.retromremakes.com) and then complain that it's different to the original :o)

[blarp]

>The whole point of this game was to be a different take on a classic game
>It's simply not meant as a definitive remake - more as a "companion piece" to a more accurate (future)remake. I'm not >sure FatSeagal agrees but that's the way I see it.

Holy Mackerel, who could argue with the words 'intention,' 'difference,' 'definitive,' and the perils of thinking too much!? It's a bird's eye view. You see everything. That buggers with the gameplay. 

But really, if anyone wants to work on a (insert term here) version of the game, I'd love to get involved =)